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Reply with quote  #1 

A few months ago Rob posted a really wonderful series of quizzes.  I don't have a whole series, but here's one question worth considering ...

 

Dr. Jastreboff writes [in his book]:

 

"... in hyperacusis by gradually introducing carefully controlled sound, it is possible to desensitize the auditory system and achieve the same level of sound tolerance as present in the general population."

 

................

 

Can somebody tell me what it's called when a person with hyperacusis has achieved the same level of sound tolerance as present in the general population?

 

sp

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LynnMcLaren

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Reply with quote  #2 

Hi Stringplayer, ((( Smiles )))

 

Regaining your normal tolerance level back or....

 

Normal hearing...

 

Or being like everybody else who's not wearing earplugs out on the streets...

 

Or the loss of being able to hear sounds that nobody else can hear but us.. 


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Reply with quote  #3 

Lynn gave four answers:

 

(1) Regaining your normal tolerance level back or....

 

...........

 

That was my question - what's it called when a hyperacusic achieves that state?

 

.............

 

(2) Normal hearing...

 

............

 

Huh?  Desensitization has nothing to do with returning an audiogram to normal.

 

...........

 

(3) Or being like everybody else who's not wearing earplugs out on the streets...

 

............

 

Again, that's my question.  What's it called?

 

............

 

(4) Or the loss of being able to hear sounds that nobody else can hear but us.. 

 

............

 

Here I believe that you are confusing hyperacusis with hyperacute hearing, Lynn.  Desensitization and returning tolerance levels to that of the general population have nothing to do with hyperacute hearing.

 

I think you are making the question much too difficult.

 

So - anybody - what is it called when a person with hyperacusis has achieved the same level of sound tolerance as present in the general population?

 

sp

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Reply with quote  #4 

TonyManaro took at shot at it:

 

Desensitization!

 

.............

 

Good try, Tony, but not what I'm looking for.

 

"Desensitization" is a process through which a person with hyperacusis can potentially arrive at a state wherein he or she has the same level of sound tolerance as is present in the general population.  That is what Dr. Jastreboff means in the sentence from his book that I quoted in my initial post in this thread.

 

I am looking for a single word that describes the state - not the process.

 

sp

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dpellerin

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Reply with quote  #5 
cured
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Reply with quote  #6 

Dp posted:

 

cured

 

.............

 

Oui, monsieur!

 

Hyperacusis is a condition characterized by a decrease in the sound tolerance over the general population.  Absent that decrease in sound tolerance, there is no hyperacusis!  If you had hyperacusis and no longer have it - and if that state is lasting - then you are cured!

 

In my experience using desensitization, much of the time the LDL's can be significantly improved - although not quite to the levels one normally sees in the general population.  But in some cases, desensitization can indeed achieve precisely that: a return to the levels one normally sees in the general population. 

 

And that ... is a cure!

 

Well done, dp!!!

 

sp

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LynnMcLaren

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Reply with quote  #7 

Hi Stringplayer ((( Smiles )))

 

Dp said cured....

 

You defined cured as....

 

Hyperacusis is a condition characterized by a decrease in the sound tolerance over the general population.  Absent that decrease in sound tolerance, there is no hyperacusis!  If you had hyperacusis and no longer have it - and if that state is lasting - then you are cured!

 

In my experience using desensitization, much of the time the LDL's can be significantly improved - although not quite to the levels one normally sees in the general population.  But in some cases, desensitization can indeed achieve precisely that: a return to the levels one normally sees in the general population. 

 

And that ... is a cure!

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

So.....What am I then.... I don't think I'm cured..

 

Yet I have over time went to different places to test my ears out and my last expirence was Chuck E Cheese and I didn't collapse back into the hyperacusis state of way back...

 

I did over a week later notice some minor sensitivity as that place is probably way past indurance and people can go to concerts and get some minor sensitivity as well but it went away on it's own for me.

 

I thought it was from the pizza pallor I went to the next week as they have big sports T.V's going there but It's never bothered me going there before..

 

So ... I thought it had to be a Chuck E Cheese hang over as that place is beyond loud..  It's incredible....

 

The decible levels at an arcade alone can be 110 db as I read that on a web site of decibles...

 

So...  what do you think that alone means for me.. Or do I have to wait even longer to know for sure what I am... Whats the time limit to know if it's lasting..

 

And what if lets say. In 3 or 5 or 10 or 20 years it comes back somehow..

 

Then was I ever really cured at all. Is it a new case of hyperacusis then or from a previously vunerablity for hyperacusis disorder...

 

How come not everybody that exposes their ears to very loud.. doesn't ever get hyperacusis from it ever at all ???

 

How come us ???

   

 


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Lynn
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Reply with quote  #8 

Lynn asked:

 

How come us ???

 

...........

 

In order to answer that, I guess I need more precisely what you mean by "us."

 

In one sentence, Lynn, what is your definition of "hyperacusis."  Apparently you have it - and I do not.  So what exactly is "it?"

 

sp

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LynnMcLaren

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Reply with quote  #9 

Hi Stringplayer, (((( Smiles ))))

 

I think it was described very well in this words of wisdom thread..

 

But thats cheating right... O.K.. What does it mean to me...

 

My answer is below yours...

 

 Hyperacusis is a decreased threshold to discomfort from sound.  It can range from a person who is mildly uncomfortable in a restaurant setting wherein all the rest of the people at the table have no discomfort at all ... to a person who has profound discomfort from many of the sounds encountered in daily life.  TRT and other desensitization techniques can be highly effective in treating hyperacusis.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

HYPERACUSIS to me.... Is a collapsed tolerance to normal environmental sounds that can be in the very mild range of discomfort to profound that includes sensitivity to high frequencies and sudden sounds that can also include a whole bunch of other symptoms as well..

 

Hyperacusis can also can be a decreased sound tolerance from the norm....

 

The description can also be based on what dictionary , or medical book that one reads..

 

Could that also go with just tinnitus ???? Sensitive to sound tinnitus...

 

And us is the people that seem to come down with this condition while others excape haveing to ever deal with hyperacusis no matter what they seem to do with their ears in life...

 

Did I do O.K.. I know.. Not one sentence but whenever have I used just one to express myself...   


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Reply with quote  #10 

Lynn posted:

 

HYPERACUSIS to me.... Is a collapsed tolerance to normal environmental sounds that can be in the very mild range of discomfort to profound that includes sensitivity to high frequencies and sudden sounds that can also include a whole bunch of other symptoms as well..

 

............

 

Not a good definition in my opinion.

 

You refer to hyperacusis including "a whole bunch of other symptoms." Other symptoms?   Like what?  Hearing loss?  Tinnitus?  A sore toe?  Diarrhea?

 

I'm trying to make a point here, Lynn.  You took issue with my statement to the effect that a treatment that returns the loudness discomfort threshholds of a hyperacusic to those of the general population may be considered to be a cure for hyperacusis.  OK.  But I can't figure out why!

 

It seems to me that what makes a hyperacusic a hyperacusic is the fact that his or her loudness discomfort threshholds are below those of the general population.  And if that's the case, then something that returns those threshholds to normal ought to be a cure.

 

But you seem to have a more global definition.  And I agree that there's no way that pink noise or TRT will cure hearing loss or tinnitus or a sore toe or diarrhea.  But I also know that's not what you meant.  And nobody includes hearing loss, tinnitus, a sore toe, or diarrhea in the definition of hyperacusis.

 

So what did you mean?  Please give me a precise definition of hyperacusis.  Because according to MY definition that you quoted:

 

"Hyperacusis is a decreased threshold to discomfort from sound,"

 

a treatment that returns that threshold to normal is, indeed, a cure.

 

sp

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LynnMcLaren

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Reply with quote  #11 

Hi Stringplayer (((( Smiles ))))

 

You Wrote...

 

 

I'm trying to make a point here, Lynn.  You took issue with my statement to the effect that a treatment that returns the loudness discomfort threshholds of a hyperacusic to those of the general population may be considered to be a cure for hyperacusis.  OK.  But I can't figure out why!

 

It seems to me that what makes a hyperacusic a hyperacusic is the fact that his or her loudness discomfort threshholds are below those of the general population.  And if that's the case, then something that returns those threshholds to normal ought to be a cure.

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------

O.K... Even thou it may be or ought to be... I just don't really know for sure... Just because a person may no longer have the symptoms. Or expirence a loudness disorder at this time...

 

What if it's just in remission and what caused the vunerablity in the first place is still there lurking there somewhere in remission... Or say it's cured..

 

But if a vunerablity still exist's inside that in the right circumstances can trigger or cause hyperacusis again . Then it wouldn't be a true fix and that wouldn't be a true cure.. But like cure.. 

 

Remissions do happen in medical circumstances as well and sometimes it goes away the symptoms for years but in the right circumstances or lets say for who knows why.... comes back.

 

But it seemed totally gone but that person would call themselves a person in remission.  Symptom free ..

 

I don't know what I am but I hope it stays away...

 

I just enjoy it being like gone...But does the vunerablity or whatever got changed inside to cause hyperacusis still exist ???? 

 

I don't that know for sure but I have read of other stories where it did like go away for years and then just in the right circumstances... Came back...

 

So I keep that in mind... And more research still needs to be done on SSSS and hyperacusis and theses syndrome's in general.... Because I wish I really new for sure... 

 

But time will tell. Maybe that time is within a lifetime to say for sure..

 

Thats why I went to Chuck E Cheeses which I realize now was a stupid thing to do.. I took a big risk... And anything could have happened...

 

And it did cause me some sensitivity long after the event.. But that went away so my ears are lots stronger to be able to withstand that kind of very loud and survive it intact...

 

It must have been 110 Db there with a room full of arcades and children yelling and voices and TV moniters all over the place and they left the door open to the stage ..

 

and we were seated close to it and they had the dancing puppets on the stage with blasting music and TV moniters there was no way I was going to sit in there because that was really freaken loud in there and it was so strange that most people weren't seating in there either.

 

Instead most people where seating on the other side of the glass at tables looking in as they had tons of room in there but people where scrambling to get a table outside of it...  

 

I remember Dan's story on his visit to the pipes pizza place.. It is real loud in there with thoses organs because I use to go there as a child and my husband brought up seeing if one of thoses are around to take the kids to and I so no way am I ever going back to one of thoses again..

 

But Chuck E Cheese was just unbelievable loud.. It's beyond fun...

 

But thats so funny.. I like that..   If I had diarrhea or a sore toe with hyperacusis.. I'm not telling ...just kidding too I understand your point...

 

The other symptoms that go along with hyperacusis.. The ones I expirenced... Would be the ones I would describe... I know I was kind of vague..

 

Let me think about and I'll write them down and would that mean if I had any one of thoses.. It would still be a sign of hyperacusis ???? 

 


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Reply with quote  #12 

Lynn posted:

 

But if a vunerablity still exist's inside that in the right circumstances can trigger or cause hyperacusis again . Then it wouldn't be a true fix and that wouldn't be a true cure.

 

..........

 

Hmmm.  I understand what you are trying to say - but I am not sure I can agree.

 

I believe you are saying that the definition of hyperacusis should include the predisposition to develop hyperacusis.  But following that logic, it should also include the predisposition to develop the predisposition to develop hyperacusis.  And on and on.

 

I have offered a straightforward one sentence definition of hyperacusis.  It's in bold in my last post.  And it is the generally accepted definition - as far as I know.

 

By that generally accepted definition, in some cases desensitization can cure hyperacusis.

 

If you would like to REdefine hyperacusis, I guess you can do that.  No law against it.

 

sp

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LynnMcLaren

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Reply with quote  #13 

Hi Stringplayer , (((( Smiles ))))

 

You posted...

 

I believe you are saying that the definition of hyperacusis should include the predisposition to develop hyperacusis. 

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Ya.. I don't know.. Did something happen to me previously that made my ears more vunerable to developing this disorder.. Caused by maybe.. Medications or Virual ect... that wasen't there before when my ears felt indestructable in my previous life...

 

That changed something maybe inside that may never be truely the same ever again.. Like brand new.. That could make my ears more vunerable now then before T and H happened.... 

 

I just don't know that for sure... Why not ten years ago twenty years ago or when I was born or a child.. When I felt I had normal do anything I want to them ears...

 

What changed. And what is left over residual... I don't know... My left ear is not normal and can still burn..

 

Yet.. So far.. That hasen't brought my hyperacusis symptoms totally back. So I don't know...

 

But on the definition of hyperacusis... If thoses are symptoms no longer in effect .. Yes.. It's gone.. Or in remission...

 

But could be called cured yet... Yet truely fixed... I just don't know... What it really is for sure...

 

Are there any long term life time studies of recovered hyperacustic people and how many never had a single reacurrance or flair up in their lifetime..

 

I mean full lifetime...

 

I would love to know the percentages on that one and if leading a normal life meant that could do anything go anyway like before and never have a flair up..

 

And to break it down which ones played it safe and which ones did not..

 

Actually tested it in theory...

 

That kind of follow up.. I would like to see done...

 


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Reply with quote  #14 

Lynn posted:

 

But on the definition of hyperacusis... If thoses are symptoms no longer in effect .. Yes.. It's gone.. Or in remission...

 

But could be called cured yet... Yet truely fixed... I just don't know... What it really is for sure...

 

............

 

Well, I don't know of any treatment that will give you the auditory system of a healthy newborn.  But if a person who could not function comfortably in society because of abnormally low loudness discomfort levels can now fully participate, the LDL's having returned to normal, then as far as I can tell, that person no longer has hyperacusis.  No remission about it.  Now, can it recur anew under certain circumstances?  Sure.  And just like a person who is prone to developing colds should take certain precautions in the winter time, a FORMER hyperacusic might be wise to try to avoid the kind of thing that kicked off the hyperacusis in the first place.  But absent abnormal LDL's after desensitization, that hyperacusic is now cured!

 

............

 

Are there any long term life time studies of recovered hyperacustic people and how many never had a single reacurrance or flair up in their lifetime..

 

I mean full lifetime...

 

I would love to know the percentages on that one and if leading a normal life meant that could do anything go anyway like before and never have a flair up..

 

And to break it down which ones played it safe and which ones did not..

 

Actually tested it in theory...

 

That kind of follow up.. I would like to see done...

 

..............

 

There are no such studies, nor likely will there ever be -- unless NIDCD and such agencies have a reason to fund hyperacusis research.  And absent some sort of advocacy initiative on the part of he hyeracusis community, they are not apt to have any clue at all as to how severely hyperacusis can impact one's life. 

 

Sorry, but that's the simple truth.

 

sp

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Matias

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Reply with quote  #15 

Its clear that we call hyperacusis to collpased tolerance to sound. That is the symptom of H. But what is H medically? Which are the reasons? Why do people get bothered by sound?

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